LongBow

[oldgun]

Looking for advice on materials for a longbow.
I have a chance for a stave. It is Red Elm how hard is the wood to work with? It is well seasoned and knot free. This is the first time for me in attempting a longbow is this wood a good choice?
I have more then enought tools just wondering about the type of wood. Thanks.

[BT]

Contact our moderator SMJ
I shoot alot of traditional but building them is out of my league.
Easternhunter may also have something to add as he has been a student of the art for a little while

[smj]

Hi oldgun! I have been a busy fellow as of late... Work has been insane and I spent the weekend up in the mountain with the kids riding dirt bikes - which is to say that I have not been able to get back to you and I am sorry for the delay! Let me see if I can give you some information here, but please note that I have not worked with red elm myself, so I can not give an off-the-cuff answer. (Sorry!)

Red Elm - specific gravity of 0.53... Hickory is 0.72 and osage is 0.82. Dry elm, not red, is at 0.56. Yew, is at 0.69 and willow is at 0.39 - so what does this mean?

Specific gravity is not the whole story, but in general, a higher specific gravity makes a better performing, more durable bow. (Again, please note that it is not the whole story.) Hickory, osage, and yew have had a lot of great bows made of these woods! Elm has had a lot of bows made as well - but here is the consideration...

The lower the specific gravity, typically you need to use larger limb size to keep the stresses down in the limb. Also, nock to nock you want a longer distance which will help keep limb stress down as well. For example, the Bowyers Bible (#1) recommends a limb width as follows (for a 66" bow, 50 pounds at 28" draw):

hickory - 1 3/4 inch wide
osage - 1 1/5 inch wide
yew - 1 3/8 inch wide
elm - 1 7/8 inch wide
willow - 3 inch wide

Also note that the more width, the more mass in the limb, usually this makes for a slower bow.

A longer draw would require a longer bow length.

I have seen red elm in glass bows, but have not seen one as belly stock for a longbow. This does not mean it would not work, but may indicate that there are better woods for belly stock!

Typically as the the specific gravity goes up, so the the difficulty in working with the wood. Hickory works pretty well, osage takes more effort! (Ipe is at something like 0.98 and is a LOT harder to work with... Coupled with bamboo makes a fast bow though!!!)

So - to answer your question - lets assume you take a 28" draw length and would like a 50 pound draw at that length. I would make the bow 68 inches long, and since this is your first bow, I would go with a 2 inch limb width. Since I am not sure about red elm, make sure you back it! There are several different types of elm, bows have been made from elm for years and years, but I am not personally sure about red elm specifically. Over build it, back it, and it will no doubt make a bow. I worry about compression on the belly since I don't know this wood and can not find a lot of detail on its use as bow material (other than as a laminate in a glass bow, which does not count here as you will not have the outer glass lam to hold it all together...) Still, the 68 inch length and 2" limb width will help that a lot, the extra length will also make the tillering process less of a challenge, too. Again, as a first bow a little over-building is not a bad idea.

I hope this helps, sorry I can't give you first-hand information on red elm. Glass bows get away with using just about any wood under the lam as the glass holds the bow together. With a longbow, the wood itself has to hold up well, or the bow breaks. Zebra wood, for example, looks great under glass... but for longbows - use it for grip sections but don't try to make a limb out of it! (Can you do it, sure. Will it be a great bow - certainly not when compared to one made of yew or osage...)

I thought I remembered a build-along from somewhere on a bow made of red elm... but I can not find it! If I come across it I will post the link. I would say give your red elm board a try, you may be very pleased with what you end up with. Having a wood that is easy to work is always a plus on a first bow.

[BT]

Thanks SMJ

[easternhunter]

oldgun said:

Looking for advice on materials for a longbow.
I have a chance for a stave. It is Red Elm how hard is the wood to work with? It is well seasoned and knot free. This is the first time for me in attempting a longbow is this wood a good choice?
I have more then enought tools just wondering about the type of wood. Thanks.

OldGun, I just found this post, and since BT volunteered me, I'll add what I know (or don't)
Red Elm has made many fine bows as I've heard people speak of it, both as selfbows and backed with various materials. It had a stringy interlocking grain which makes it good wood . I'd maybe look for some hickory if you have access as it's one of the best bow woods next to Osage and Yew. How hard to work? I dunno personally...I'd keep my tools sharp! But that goes for any woodworking I guess.. I'm waiting for the City parks dept. to call me with some surplus elm and locust...can't wait!
Hope this helps some.
P.S. I concur with most of what SMJ told you above.

[Coca Cola]

From what I have read on other forums such as primative archer it is a good bow wood. For some reason it seems popular with childrens selfbows. I dont know if that is because it makes a good shortbow or because the dads of the children dont want to sacrifice a nice piece of osage or hickory on a bow that will be outgrown by next year;).

Maybe in a coulple of days I will be able to share some wisdom on the wood. I am going to be visiting my treestands and 2/5 are in elm trees. Not sure on what type. But if there is usable bow wood I will come back with some.

[oldgun]

Thankyou for the replies, I'm still not sure of the wood I will use. Up here is ThunderBay Can. I'm haveing to look hard to find anything seasoned enought to work with. Again thankyou all the comments and advice is appreciated. Will keep on looking.

[easternhunter]

Oldgun. G'day eh? I'm a Canuck too from DownEast..don't overlook using surplus hardwood flooring, sometimes you can get hickory or ash-elm-maple etc as well as alot of tropical hardwood including Jatoba-IPE...all decent bowwood, either in full length pieces or spliced together from 2 shorter sections.....I got a lumber bin full of ash-maple and red oak waiting to be spliced. A lot of it was freebie left-over or broken boxes un-saleable at the flooring store.
I've built 3, count 'em....3 bows now..
1 - vertical grain bamboo (came in way too light)
2- hickory backed Jatoba (Brazilian Cherry) 2 sections spliced together... still working on this one (limb twisted from my impatience in glue-up.)
3 - a second hickory backed Jatoba longbow, which will make hunting weight 50-55lbs. at 27 in. pretty pleased with this one, preliminary shoot-in shows it to be pretty quick. Now I gotta finesse the final draw weight and finish.

SMJ, I'll post some pics soon of this one...I shoot it at Stilllearnin's place tonite..short drawn at 24 in. pulling about 50 lbs.